T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Discussion about MixBox and T-RackS

Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby smata65 » Wed Oct 07, 2015 5:41 am

Amicus717 wrote:My 4.5 cents:

1) Tape emulation
2) console emulation
3) Neve 1073
3a) API 550 EQ
4) dbx 160
5) tube saturation plugin
6) convolution reverb

I'd be very interested to hear IK's take on any of the above, and I'm sure it will be great. Until last year's group buy, I frankly had never really paid much attention to T-RackS plugins, but I got into the group buy and grabbed a bunch of them. A year later, and they are among my favorites, and form a significant part of my go-to arsenal.



3 and 3a are already part of T-Racks. EQ 73 and EQ PA respectively :ugeek:
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Wed Oct 07, 2015 12:41 pm

Amicus717 wrote:My 4.5 cents:

1) Tape emulation
2) console emulation
3) Neve 1073
3a) API 550 EQ
4) dbx 160
5) tube saturation plugin
6) convolution reverb

I'd be very interested to hear IK's take on any of the above, and I'm sure it will be great. Until last year's group buy, I frankly had never really paid much attention to T-RackS plugins, but I got into the group buy and grabbed a bunch of them. A year later, and they are among my favorites, and form a significant part of my go-to arsenal.

There's is already a 1073 emulation and a 550EQ emulation available in TRacks. Agreed though on the DBX160. I'm not a fan of tape and console sims and convolution reverbs have been done to death.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Fri Nov 13, 2015 6:32 pm

Tape and console sims seem like no brainers.
Maybe they will come with T-Racks 5.0
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Fri Nov 13, 2015 10:52 pm

clintmartin wrote:Tape and console sims seem like no brainers.
Maybe they will come with T-Racks 5.0

What could IK bring to the table that Slate and Waves haven't? Maybe something other than SSL and Neve consoles - now that would be nice. A tube-based console would be welcome.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Fri Nov 13, 2015 11:37 pm

Well, I don't own any Waves or Slate plugins so...I don't know. I use Harrison Mixbus or the console sims in Sonar when I want that vibe. When I think of T-Racks, I think of it in standalone mode, and what could make it better. A wave editor built in that could be use for each wav file would be nice. Being able to make crossfades and place cd markers would also be nice.
T-racks 5 has an opportunity to be a huge step up...hopefully it will be.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Sat Nov 14, 2015 1:52 pm

clintmartin wrote:Well, I don't own any Waves or Slate plugins so...I don't know. I use Harrison Mixbus or the console sims in Sonar when I want that vibe. When I think of T-Racks, I think of it in standalone mode, and what could make it better. A wave editor built in that could be use for each wav file would be nice. Being able to make crossfades and place cd markers would also be nice.
T-racks 5 has an opportunity to be a huge step up...hopefully it will be.

Never used TRacks standalone; always inside either ProTools or Digital Performer. Now if by standalone you mean individual modules that's another matter and that's the mode I use it in most often; I do use the other mode whatever it's called to have a single point collection of modules I tend to use on my 2-bus.

Wave edits and crossfades wouldn't really be a good function for TRacks and again there are existing options out there. Being your on Windows you have the excellent Sony Soundforge which I used to use years ago before I went all-Mac here. It's just a shame Sony still hasn't updated CD Architect (not to mention it only uses dx format plugins). SF-Mac still isn't ready for prime-time and I use DSP Quattro for all my wave editing and cd assemblage work.

When you start putting in more and more functionality into a program that was never meant to do that you can end up with all kinds of issues that shouldn't exist. Best to let programs that were built from the get-go handle the load. Don't think I'm anti-progress I just don't want to see a good program go bad. That's why I waited until this year to go to Reason 8 from Reason 3 - to see that it was stable and did what it said it was supposed to do.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Sat Nov 14, 2015 3:58 pm

By standalone I mean...Using only the T-Racks shell without using a daw. I like to import the final mixes into T-racks and tweak and level the tracks. I do have Sound Forge and Adobe Audition 3, but a basic wav editor is all I really need.
Because of the limitations, I prefer the stay in Sonar and make my own mastering chain. T-racks ends up being a reference or something that I try to use for fun. It's nice to open it up without having to open Sonar at all. The ARC 2 integration makes this possible.
So far I haven't heard anything about T-Racks 5. I'm still hoping for a Christmas surprise, but it's looking like another year without a substantial upgrade.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Sun Nov 15, 2015 1:33 am

clintmartin wrote:By standalone I mean...Using only the T-Racks shell without using a daw. I like to import the final mixes into T-racks and tweak and level the tracks. I do have Sound Forge and Adobe Audition 3, but a basic wav editor is all I really need.
Because of the limitations, I prefer the stay in Sonar and make my own mastering chain. T-racks ends up being a reference or something that I try to use for fun. It's nice to open it up without having to open Sonar at all. The ARC 2 integration makes this possible.
So far I haven't heard anything about T-Racks 5. I'm still hoping for a Christmas surprise, but it's looking like another year without a substantial upgrade.

You're using the wrong tool to do the job you want to do. You really should use either SF or Audition (even though you have an ancient version of Audition).

How does one use the TRacks shell without a daw?
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Sun Nov 15, 2015 2:34 pm

n2mpujack wrote:You're using the wrong tool to do the job you want to do. You really should use either SF or Audition (even though you have an ancient version of Audition).

How does one use the TRacks shell without a daw?


This thread is asking what we would like to see and I'm only saying what I think could make T-Racks better. I do use Adobe Audition 3 as a wav editor. It works great and it works as a utility within Sonar. There isn't any exporting or importing of files. Sound forge works the same way, but I like AA3 better.
Just open T-Racks like any other program. It works perfectly fine on it's own. Drag and drop your wav files in the shell. You can have your entire cd in it, with each song having a different effect chain and settings. You just click on each song and balance the levels.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAh-4FbEyzY
This video shows the standalone version right at the start. I didn't watch the whole thing, but it explains the 3 ways to use T-Racks.
Standalone, Plugin or singles.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Sun Nov 15, 2015 7:32 pm

clintmartin wrote:
n2mpujack wrote:You're using the wrong tool to do the job you want to do. You really should use either SF or Audition (even though you have an ancient version of Audition).

How does one use the TRacks shell without a daw?


This thread is asking what we would like to see and I'm only saying what I think could make T-Racks better. I do use Adobe Audition 3 as a wav editor. It works great and it works as a utility within Sonar. There isn't any exporting or importing of files. Sound forge works the same way, but I like AA3 better.
Just open T-Racks like any other program. It works perfectly fine on it's own. Drag and drop your wav files in the shell. You can have your entire cd in it, with each song having a different effect chain and settings. You just click on each song and balance the levels.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RAh-4FbEyzY
This video shows the standalone version right at the start. I didn't watch the whole thing, but it explains the 3 ways to use T-Racks.
Standalone, Plugin or singles.

Thanks for the link but I still wouldn't work with TRacks in a standalone mode because I need and use plugins that are not available in Tracks so it wouldn't work your way. I still believe, as do many others, that one is better off using a purpose built tool that's been designed from the start as a waveform editor, CD layout, etc.
But hey - everyone works their own way but I don't want to see TRacks get gummed up with stuff that is better done elsewheres. The term 'bloatware' comes to mind.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:12 pm

It doesn't seem like anything new is on the horizon anyway, but if it's called a mastering suite it should be able to perform the basics of mastering. Having the proper tools shouldn't be considered bloat. If I have to use my daw and a wave editor, I don't see the point of having T-Racks at all.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:34 pm

clintmartin wrote:It doesn't seem like anything new is on the horizon anyway, but if it's called a mastering suite it should be able to perform the basics of mastering. Having the proper tools shouldn't be considered bloat. If I have to use my daw and a wave editor, I don't see the point of having T-Racks at all.

Waveform editing is not a function of the mastering process. There's a difference between mastering and having a mastering suite of plugins. Until Ozone 7 you could not use that product as a standalone mastering tool; you had to use it inside either a daw or waveform editor like Soundforge or Audition or whatever audio editor one uses. But you still can't do things like fades in it so you need a separate program for that purpose. A 'suite' is just a collection of things in one place. TRacks provides you with the tools to use in mastering and is not really a standalone mastering program as such.

Really mastering is about making things work together in an assemblage for an album and is not meant for deep editing. And if you have to do deep editing then you're better off going back and having the music remixed. Mastering can't polish a turd, if you will.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Sun Nov 15, 2015 8:55 pm

n2mpujack wrote:
Waveform editing is not a function of the mastering process. There's a difference between mastering and having a mastering suite of plugins. Until Ozone 7 you could not use that product as a standalone mastering tool; you had to use it inside either a daw or waveform editor like Soundforge or Audition or whatever audio editor one uses. But you still can't do things like fades in it so you need a separate program for that purpose. A 'suite' is just a collection of things in one place. TRacks provides you with the tools to use in mastering and is not really a standalone mastering program as such.

Really mastering is about making things work together in an assemblage for an album and is not meant for deep editing. And if you have to do deep editing then you're better off going back and having the music remixed. Mastering can't polish a turd, if you will.


I agree with most of what you say, but waveform editing can (IMHO it should) be part of the mastering process, and T-Racks could easily be a great standalone mastering program. I see no harm in making a product better. Since T-Racks doesn't allow the use of 3rd party plugins...they really need to add the essential tools a lot of people use. If they want the Standalone option to be useful.
It's still a great program. I have all of the modules except the stealth limiter, and it's certainly a nice useful tool on the master bus, but I vote they try to make it the best mastering suite available.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby n2mpujack » Sun Nov 15, 2015 10:54 pm

clintmartin wrote:
n2mpujack wrote:
Waveform editing is not a function of the mastering process. There's a difference between mastering and having a mastering suite of plugins. Until Ozone 7 you could not use that product as a standalone mastering tool; you had to use it inside either a daw or waveform editor like Soundforge or Audition or whatever audio editor one uses. But you still can't do things like fades in it so you need a separate program for that purpose. A 'suite' is just a collection of things in one place. TRacks provides you with the tools to use in mastering and is not really a standalone mastering program as such.

Really mastering is about making things work together in an assemblage for an album and is not meant for deep editing. And if you have to do deep editing then you're better off going back and having the music remixed. Mastering can't polish a turd, if you will.


I agree with most of what you say, but waveform editing can (IMHO it should) be part of the mastering process, and T-Racks could easily be a great standalone mastering program. I see no harm in making a product better. Since T-Racks doesn't allow the use of 3rd party plugins...they really need to add the essential tools a lot of people use. If they want the Standalone option to be useful.
It's still a great program. I have all of the modules except the stealth limiter, and it's certainly a nice useful tool on the master bus, but I vote they try to make it the best mastering suite available.
TRacks will never be the best mastering suite available because there are other better purpose built programs that do the job. The previously mentioned Ozone 7 is but one. There are only a couple of plugins in TRacks that would even be fit for mastering. The Mastering EQ432 and maybe the Quad Comp and that's it. Everything else is better suited on individual tracks in a piece of music or on the 2-bus. A Manley Massive Passive EQ would be a good add as would be a transparent compressor. Mastering engineers generally don't have a ton of hardware consisting of stuff like a Pultec EQ, 1176 and LA2A compressors, any one of a number of buss compressors, etc. The bulk of their hardware goes into things like quality ad/da converters, monitors and amps to power them, along with excellent quality eq and compressor and limiter with the most important thing - proper room acoustics.

And again mastering engineers don't do any waveform editing other than to maybe add fades to a piece of mixed music. By the time one gets to mastering the tune is already mixed; mastering engineers don't get the raw tracks of a piece of music. I've seen where a mastering engineer will throw music back to the mixer to redo a piece of music because even with all the tools that a mastering engineer has he/she can't make a piece work with other pieces of music as a whole.

Most of what's in TRacks is best suited for a mixing or tracking situation. I'm not saying that because of the quality of the plugins but the actual functions of those plugins. Tape delay - you'll never see it in a mastering room.
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Re: T-RackS: What would you like to see?

Postby clintmartin » Sun Nov 15, 2015 11:19 pm

Once again I agree for the most part, but I'm coming at this from the angle of a home studio. Nothing will ever be sent out for mastering here...it's not worth the expense sadly.
Making T-Racks better than Ozone 7 is what I mean when I say the best mastering suite available.
For now I'll stick to my normal formula of tracking and mixing in Sonar. Mastering will be done in Sonar, Harrison Mixbus, T-Racks, Soundforge , Adobe Audition or a combination of the four.
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